water pump

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wolfgang

water pump

#1 Post by wolfgang » Fri Sep 16, 2005 5:48 am

I am planning on using a big thick racing radiator on my current project and an extra smaller radiator in the bellypan.<p>I know there are some real specialists amongst you who could answer following questions:<br>- is the stock water pump able to feed such an arrangement? <br>- would an electric water pump work better (less internal engine losses, higher troughput, adjustable temperature threshold?<br>- is it beneficial to remove thermostat?<br>- what would be the best configuration for these 2 radiators (serial or parallel)?<br>I currently have the following setup in mind:<p>from thermostat housing to big radiator input, big radiator output to small radiator input, small radiator output to water pump. This would not provide any preference for the rear cylinders, would keep the cooling distribution as stock.<p>Lets hear your opinions or experiebces.<p>best regards<p>Wolfgang
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wolfgang_hromada@aon.at

Eric

Re: water pump

#2 Post by Eric » Fri Sep 16, 2005 4:21 pm

Wolfgang,<br>How do you plan to flow air across the small radiator your considering mounting in the bellypan?<p>Eric
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rzv500r@aol.com

wolfgang

Re: water pump

#3 Post by wolfgang » Fri Sep 16, 2005 11:59 pm

Eric,<br>air should flow through a hole in the front of the bellypan. I will be using a 1996 or 1999 YZR500 fairing. <br>Main reason for this addition of a second rad in the bellypan is to be as close as possible to the real YZR500...it should be a replica, a 1:1 scale model so to say.
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wolfgang_hromada@aon.at

Jeff B

Re: water pump

#4 Post by Jeff B » Sat Sep 17, 2005 10:00 am

Where did you find a 99 YZR500 faring?
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beeks81@aol.com

wolfgang

Re: water pump

#5 Post by wolfgang » Sat Sep 17, 2005 10:06 am

Jeff, I dont want to tell until I have it in my hands. Have just seen pics till now.<p>regards<p>Wolfgang
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wolfgang_hromada@aon.at

Paul K

Re: water pump

#6 Post by Paul K » Sat Sep 17, 2005 12:35 pm

Have you ever considered having a fiberglass worker pull molds on the fairing before you mount it? You may even make a few bucks selling them................. Paul K.
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paulkjeweler@sbcglobal.net

Rob

Re: water pump

#7 Post by Rob » Sat Sep 17, 2005 3:11 pm

I would take one - Airtech really screws you on the price of the one they make because they are all important and the only ones with the molds etc etc - you would think with all the money they could actually fix the broken links on their website that have been broken for years!<p>Rob
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roadkillrobert@yahoo.com

wolfgang

Re: water pump

#8 Post by wolfgang » Sat Sep 17, 2005 11:36 pm

I already have a 1996 YZR500 fairing from Mick Costin (see Out in Front section) which will become redundant if I get my hands on the 1999 fairing. Differencies are minor though, the nose piece is slightly different and the air ducts on the side panels.<br>I am selling the 1996 fairing then, but shippig to US could become expensive.<br>I

Rob

Re: water pump

#9 Post by Rob » Sun Sep 18, 2005 3:51 am

Sure - the pump is like a firehose - lots of volume and pressure - presumably because the cooling system was pretty small, they just moved the water faster! I am trying one of RL's rads behind the main rad and it is plumbed just for the rear cylinders - pressure is so high that you either need to take out the thermostat or drill out the bypass hole and add a second hole to bleed off the pressure until the thermostat opens. General consensus is that the rears run hot and fail pistons more often, I am not convinced it is a poor cooling design - it gets lots of water at the same temp as the fronts, only issue is that the fonts flow bottom up and out, where the rears get cool water in the head and have to circulate down and back up, not optimal, but not horrible - probably most rear piston failures could be avioded with proper jetting and plugs to compensate, but that is probably more difficult than the average person wants to tackle. Personally I think Just having more cooling capacity may help as much and run the rears a little rich on the jetting, maybe 220's rear 210's front or something like that depending on your jet requirements, and maybe a clip more on the needle. Dual thermostats would fix the issue also, one for the fronts and one for the rears, but that could be an issue with the space under the tank.<br>Anyway - as for your 2 rad solution, since you are running a YZR fairing, you have a lot of extra room at the front and can fit the ZX-7/9 Radiator mod under the fairing, which is much cheaper than a custom rad and has a huge capacity compared to the stock + a small rad - it is curved and fits nicely - the input and outputs work out nicely and the filler is remote like the RZ, about as close to a bolt on as you will get and it will triple your cooling capacity. I think stuffing a small rad in the chin area will be a big challenge as there is not much room (although there is a fair bit more on the YZR faring, but I think flow will be an issue as it will be right up against the exhaust and heads down there. I have a ZX-9 rad here if you want it - needs some minor repair, but would be easy to do yourself/ or cheap to have done - I can give you all the dimensions if you want to check fit and send some pics - I think the 7 and 9 are the same, but most people use the 7 rad under the yzr fairing, so it may be a little smaller.<p>I don't want to stifle your creativity, I would love to see what you could come up with for a fresh idea - the zx-7 is proven and cheap though. I think someone on the board was also working on Dual VFR800 rads, as they are the same width as stock, but better rads and he though you could fit 2 stacked under the stock bodywork, with the YZR bodywork, you can fit a lot more stuff because of the width.<p>Keep me posted on the 96 bodywork.<p>Rob
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roadkillrobert@yahoo.com

wolfgang

Re: water pump

#10 Post by wolfgang » Sun Sep 18, 2005 8:10 am

Rob,<br>thanks for your comments. I am already using a ZX7 radiator in my Rainey Replica and yes, it is a very god and easy to do solution.<br>This time I want something really racing-like and I am going to have a radiator custom made exactly for my needs. The lower rad for the bellypan I already have and it fits nice and easily in the YZR bellypan, it is bolted to the lower cylinder heads and sits far enough away from the exhausts. <br>I am not sure I understand your comments on the water pump though (I am german speaking). Did you mean the stock water pump has so much pressure and capacity or were you referring to an aftermarket electric water pump? I am thinking of one with an electronic controller were you can even adjust temperture - like an electronic adjustable thermostat. I just dont know if this water pump flows more water/higher pressure than the stock one since there are no specs for the stock pump.
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wolfgang_hromada@aon.at

Rob

Re: water pump

#11 Post by Rob » Sun Sep 18, 2005 3:25 pm

I meant that the stock water pump puts up a lot of pressure, it should not be an issue running more rad. Not sure how it would compare to an electric one, except it is less likely to fail, but it would be cool to have adjustable temperature, as the stock one opens pretty late, it would be nice to let it open a little sooner - i think it would be a neat solution, but I'm not sure the RZ's electrics are up to it - it can barely run the fan and if the fan runs too long, it gets ahead of the battery - I think some of the issues with the cooling system, late opening thermostat and a fan that doesn't kick in until the last possible minute are more an issue of the poor output of the RZ alternator than anything - they don't want the fan running any more than needed.<p>Rob
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roadkillrobert@yahoo.com

wolfgang

Re: water pump

#12 Post by wolfgang » Sun Sep 18, 2005 11:05 pm

Rob, the current consumption is not an issue with my bike. The electric pump draws max. 1.2Amps. I will be using an LED rearlight which saves about half of this already.
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wolfgang_hromada@aon.at

Paul K

Re: water pump

#13 Post by Paul K » Mon Sep 19, 2005 4:20 pm

There is a guy out here in Southern Cal who makes absolutely beautiful aluminum radiators that bolt on and are about 35% more capacity, work great........... If you are interested, let me know, I'll give you his email.<p>Paul K
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paulkjeweler@sbcglobal.net

Jeff B

Re: water pump

#14 Post by Jeff B » Tue Sep 20, 2005 12:41 pm

I think your biggest concern with the radiators is the flow. <p>Is the small radiator going to restrict flow if you run the coolant in a series? <p>If you run a parallel setup you'll want (roughly) 3/4's of the coolant to go through the big radiator. You could have overheating problems if too much coolant goes through the small radiator and bypasses the large one.<p>I've never heard anyone say the stock pump was insufficient. Personally I think an electric pump would complicate things even though it may work better.
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beeks81@aol.com

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