wits end with RG500

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mark b
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Joined: Thu Jun 25, 2015 4:37 pm

wits end with RG500

#1 Post by mark b » Fri Aug 19, 2016 5:44 pm

Hi can any body please help me :smt010 as I am at my wits end with my RG500.(bare with me its a long story)
I will start at the beginning, I brought the bike from a dealer, which I traveled across sea and land to pick up,
when I arrived the guy told me he had some bad news in that he went to service the bike but could not get it running.
He said his mechanics had checked everything and was sure it was just the stator as the spark was virtually none existent, so said to me if you can come back next week I have another RG500 coming in so i will swap the stator, that was out the question for me as I had taken 2 days off work and spent £300+going to get it ,so I decided I would take the bike and he would send the stator, which he did but to no avail, he then sent the coils and cdi unit again all to no avail, remember these all come from a running bike? So I thought it must be carbs as I had changed all the electrics.
I then ordered a carb kit off ebay and fitted that, the bike burst into life but not for long :smt013 The plugs were getting fuel but the spark did seem very week.
:idea: I will phone Lance Gamma, after a very helpful conversation I checked the disc valves only to find they were out and would not time up :smt011 by now I am starting to lose the plot :smt009 there was only one thing left to do, take the motor to Stan Stephens and let him work his magic.
I live in the Channel islands so back across the water with the motor to Stan's workshop.
About 8 weeks later I picked the motor back up from Stan who told me the crank timing was out and one of the disc valves had been cut to compensate, sorted I thought :grin:
Got back to Guernsey, put the motor back in the bike and started kicking, Bike would fire but not start :idea: pilot jets, I had the exact same thing with my Honda NS400.
This I did and I put all original carb kit back with new float valves (genuine)and new choke cable carb screw guides as mine were split, set floats at 17mm etc.
First kick and away she went, but not for long, went down to 2 cylinders, both left cylinders cut out :smt010 :idea: I hadn't checked the fuel tap so checked that and found ok but the filter was split, but you cant buy just the filter so I had to get a very expensive new tap :smt009 New Plugs fitted went back through carbs as I can almost strip them blind folded now just to make double sure and again away she went on all 4 till the little bit of fuel I had in it run out.
topped up fuel and surprise surprise its back to normal, fires but wont start :smt013 so that is where I am, almost skint and back on suicide watch :smt009
Also fitted new crank pick up.
Any ideas please

phillcbx
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Joined: Tue Mar 01, 2016 12:09 pm

Re: wits end with RG500

#2 Post by phillcbx » Fri Aug 19, 2016 7:49 pm

Hi Mark,

try starting the bike with the petrol cap right open, put a rag over it.

Cheers Phill

mark b
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Joined: Thu Jun 25, 2015 4:37 pm

Re: wits end with RG500

#3 Post by mark b » Sat Aug 20, 2016 4:26 am

Thanks Phill,
Already tried that, again to no avail

davidcumbria
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Location: Lake District, U.K.

Re: wits end with RG500

#4 Post by davidcumbria » Sat Aug 20, 2016 4:41 am

Sorry you are having such a time of it can be very frustrating but in the end it's just an engine so there will be a solution. From what you wrote about the the last stages it did run properly until it ran out of fuel. Sounds as if something has been sucked into the carbs and you have had the feeds apart recently and a broken filter allowing stuff in. Check the floats chambers are full and the float valves are clear. Good luck doesn't sound like you are far off now.

rd84
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Re: wits end with RG500

#5 Post by rd84 » Sat Aug 20, 2016 7:10 am

Have you checked the fuel lines and inside of the tank for lacquer and other crap from the fuel ? - when I did my RD500 many years ago I kept having problems and it turned out to be the fuel lines and tank that needed to have a large build up of fuel lacquer removing because this kept polluting my carbs after every carb clean - the fuel lacquer continued to flow into the carbs over the weeks and months until it was removed from the entire fuel system.

Can you try a auxiliary fuel tank and new fuel lines with no fuel tap to exclude this part of the fuel system from your problems list ? - Have you checked the fuel level in the float bowls ? - I don't have a RG500 - is it a vacuum type fuel tap like the RD500 ? - is the vacuum line split or blocked ?

Don't give up - you'll solve it - but I know how you feel !

Cheers
Paul

mark b
Posts: 10
Joined: Thu Jun 25, 2015 4:37 pm

Re: wits end with RG500

#6 Post by mark b » Sat Aug 20, 2016 5:22 pm

Thanks for replies and encouragement lads :smt023 I will check carbs one last time but they do have a secondary filter where fuel line joins carbs, so not that convinced.
Think I need a magician not mechanic :shock:

mark b
Posts: 10
Joined: Thu Jun 25, 2015 4:37 pm

Re: wits end with RG500

#7 Post by mark b » Tue Aug 23, 2016 4:43 am

I have spent more time checking bike over and I'm now convinced it's due to intermittent sparking.
I cleaned all connections and checked joints but will spark one minute but not the next,
It's very strange as like I've said before when I first got the bike I swapped the coils,cdi and stator but to no avail.
Yesterday I took plugs out which were wet with fuel, and checked for spark, checked no4 and that was sparking then checked rest but no spark so went back to no4 and no spark, I brought some new iridium plugs and that made no difference.
Any ideas please

rd84
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Re: wits end with RG500

#8 Post by rd84 » Tue Aug 23, 2016 5:21 am

Lots of articles like these around .....

https://www.denniskirk.com/learn/how-to ... motorcycle

http://www.dansmc.com/cdiignition.htm

Hope it helps.

Cheers
Paul

Vin
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Re: wits end with RG500

#9 Post by Vin » Tue Aug 23, 2016 6:17 am

Are you using the old loom? earths on these 30+ year old bikes deteriorate so may be worth trying separate earth feeds to coils etc.

Wouldn't have thought it would fire but electrical issues can give you illogical problems sometimes, listening to your comments though it sounded to me fuel feed problems as others have suggested?

MK
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Re: wits end with RG500

#10 Post by MK » Tue Aug 23, 2016 7:26 am

If it comes to ignition I'd usually use a Zeeltronic or Ignitech CDI. Both fully programmable and around 200 Eur
If the budget is higher you can add this one
http://www.performancefab.co.uk/rg500-l ... -generator" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Bye
Martin

silverstrom
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Re: wits end with RG500

#11 Post by silverstrom » Tue Aug 23, 2016 2:04 pm

mark b wrote:I have spent more time checking bike over and I'm now convinced it's due to intermittent sparking.
I cleaned all connections and checked joints but will spark one minute but not the next,
It's very strange as like I've said before when I first got the bike I swapped the coils,cdi and stator but to no avail.
Yesterday I took plugs out which were wet with fuel, and checked for spark, checked no4 and that was sparking then checked rest but no spark so went back to no4 and no spark, I brought some new iridium plugs and that made no difference.
Any ideas please
Have you looked at plug caps and wires? Those are the usual culprits. Cut 5 mm from the end of each wire and use new resistor caps and resistor plugs. If you have non-resistor plugs and non-resistor caps you will have issues with the ignition due to electromagnetic interference. If you can replace the entire plug wire (HT lead) it's even better.

mark b
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Joined: Thu Jun 25, 2015 4:37 pm

Re: wits end with RG500

#12 Post by mark b » Sun Aug 28, 2016 5:06 pm

Here is the latest!
in the week I cleaned all connections checked spark and all was good so put fuel tank on and she fired up tweeked carbs and was ticking over fine :smile: next day started to put back together kicked it over and guess what :smt009 back to normal :smt013
Saturday looking back through the manual and realised I had made wrong adjustment on carbs so took off corrected my stupid error and guess what ........started first kick and was running perfect, turned off went back later and started first kick :grin: so today rebuilt bike and polished up,my son came round so I said I've got a surprise for you check this out :cool: jumped on as proud as punch kicked over, I don't think I need to tell you what happened next :smt010 nothing :smt013 fires every kick but just won't run :smt017 starting to lose the will to live.

Vin
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Re: wits end with RG500

#13 Post by Vin » Sun Aug 28, 2016 5:47 pm

Sounds like every time you put it back together it disturbs a wire connection or electrical block, I would strip it back down to as little as possible but able to run again and whilst it is running wiggle all connections and wires to see if you can pin point the fault, I had a similar issue with my TLR1000 and found out a micro earth connector going into the ECU would vibrate out of the block connector that affected the starting......... worth a try but sounds like you are closer??

suzsmokeyallan
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Re: wits end with RG500

#14 Post by suzsmokeyallan » Tue Aug 30, 2016 2:58 am

The ignition coils are powered by the white and white with blue stripe wires from the CDI box. Try running separate wires from the box connector to the coils and see if the spark output changes. Its also worth checking the orange input wire at the CDI box with the ignition switch on for 12 volts.
I've pulled a few RG harnesses apart for upgrading and restoration and found a lot of shoddy hidden workmanship.
Hows the ignition switches internal contacts as well, your symptoms of an electrical issue regarding a weak or intermittent spark seem to be the main issue.
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76 Suzuki GT750
76 Suzuki TS400
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86 Suzuki RG500 x2
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15 Kawasaki Ninja H2

mark b
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Re: wits end with RG500

#15 Post by mark b » Tue Aug 30, 2016 3:30 am

Thank's for all your replies, I will spend some more time today checking the electrics :smt023

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