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 Post subject: PV Control Box HELP
PostPosted: Sun May 13, 2018 8:15 am 
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Joined: Fri Nov 28, 2014 8:08 pm
Posts: 16
I completed a ground up restoration on my RD, it smoked a lot when first started which wasn't a problem as I was running it in. However, I was going to re-set the oil pump and found it wouldn't close, on further examination I found that the Power Valves were always in the open position even when the ignition was turned off. I was under the impression that the valves should close when the ignition is turned off then when turned on it should be open, close, open then when you again turn the ignition to off the valves should close and in doing so the oil pump closes also.

To clarify: my valves are open when ignition is off then the sequence goes close, open when ignition is turned on, in turn this means the oil pump is at half open when ignition is off and goes close, half open when ignition is turned on.

As this is my first RD500 I am a bit of a novice on these settings so my questions are should the Power Valves be closed when ignition is off and when turned on should they be open and what setting should the oil pump be at IE closed or half open when ignition is on?

Hopefully I am explaining things correctly, if not I will clarify any points necessary.

Thanks.


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 Post subject: Re: PV Control Box HELP
PostPosted: Sun May 13, 2018 2:59 pm 
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Location: Eastern Ontario Canada
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yg96jsGoy2M

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 Post subject: Re: PV Control Box HELP
PostPosted: Mon May 14, 2018 6:52 am 
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Joined: Fri Nov 28, 2014 8:08 pm
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Hi Silverstrom,
Thanks for taking the time to reply, I did however go online and research what I could and viewed the link you posted, however, what I was looking for was someone who could tell me that the valves should be closed or open and the oil pump should be closed or half open when the ignition is off.
I believe that the valves and the oil pump should both be closed and therefore my PV box wasn't working correctly, but I had someone tell me that my PV box was working correctly and if this is true then the valves should be open and the oil pump at half open when ignition is off (still don't believe this is correct).
I even changed over my servo motor cables to see if they were wrong but this only reversed what was happening.
Any help would be appreciated.


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 Post subject: Re: PV Control Box HELP
PostPosted: Mon May 14, 2018 7:10 am 
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Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 12:54 pm
Posts: 253
Location: Germany
Sounds about right.
Switch ignition on, sound ssstsstsst, after sound ends, vales are OPEN.
If engine is started now, valves go to CLOSED position. If you rev it above around 6.5k they start opening and should be fully open shortly above 8k (all stock box).
Different boxes may alter the actuation rpms, but all behave principally the same.

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 Post subject: Re: PV Control Box HELP
PostPosted: Mon May 14, 2018 10:54 am 
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Joined: Fri Nov 28, 2014 8:08 pm
Posts: 16
Hi Martin,

I don't know if I'm explaining properly, my valves are open when ignition is off and they never close, my oil pump never closes also.
I thought it would be the PV controller but am open to trying anything else that it may be?


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 Post subject: Re: PV Control Box HELP
PostPosted: Mon May 14, 2018 3:04 pm 
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Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 12:54 pm
Posts: 253
Location: Germany
If they are open and you switch on the ignition they should move and you hear a ssst ssst sound.
If that's not the case something is wrong. Sometimes as easy as a blown fuse or loose connection but often it's the control box.

If ignition is switched off, nothing will move as there's no juice to do so. That's normal.

If you meant you have switched on the ignition and it stays open and does nothing: That's normal as long you don't start the engine.
It moves when you start and rev up. If that's not the case see the above section.

If the controller is blown, I'd always tend to buying a Zeeltronic ignition and PV box. Not that is fixes the issue at just a few bucks more than a 30 yo used bix, it easily adds 10 or more horses with a decent curve.

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 Post subject: Re: PV Control Box HELP
PostPosted: Mon May 14, 2018 6:35 pm 
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Joined: Fri Nov 28, 2014 8:08 pm
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Thanks Martin,
This is where the confusion arises, the manual and any videos online all show the valves closing, and the oil pump returning to closed also, when the ignition is turned off.
My valves stay open (when ignition is switched off) and my oil pump at the half open mark making it impossible to set the pump correctly.
The pump was my main reason for the inspection as my bike smokes real bad and wet oil comes from the muffler when engine is turned off.
My valves do ssst ssst when ignition is turned on but again they never close and neither does my pump.
I will now look at the Zeeltronic as it sounds like I should fit one anyway.
Really appreciate your reply.


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 Post subject: Re: PV Control Box HELP
PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2018 7:27 am 
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Joined: Tue Jul 19, 2011 7:49 pm
Posts: 244
Location: Toulouse France
As Martin said, the important thing to notice is if the engine runs or not.
What you describe is correct if the engine doesn't run but not when it is started ( valves should close ).

And you have two ways to stop the engine : with ignition switch or with kill switch.
If you turn off the ignition switch, then you have no more alimentation for the power valves and so they can't move any further.
If you turn off the kill switch, power valves are still powered and they should move from closed position ( when engine is at idle speed ) to the opened position ( when engine is stopped ).


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 Post subject: Re: PV Control Box HELP
PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2018 3:10 pm 
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Joined: Fri Nov 28, 2014 8:08 pm
Posts: 16
Many thanks for the reply,
As my valves stay open (when ignition is turned off) would you put this down to the PV Controller, or is there something else that could be causing the fault.
I have ruled out the servo motor as this checks out ok.


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 Post subject: Re: PV Control Box HELP
PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2018 6:50 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jul 19, 2011 7:49 pm
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Location: Toulouse France
To be clear, what do you mean by "ignition is turned off" ?
*) Engine is stopped and you turn off the ignition key ?
*) Engine is running and you turn off the ignition key ?
*) Engine is running and you turn off the kill switch ?

So my question is again : what happens when the engine is started and running at idle speed ?


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 Post subject: Re: PV Control Box HELP
PostPosted: Mon May 21, 2018 8:28 am 
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Joined: Fri Nov 28, 2014 8:08 pm
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Engine is stopped and turn off the ignition key , valves remain open.
When ignition key is turned on the valves go from open to close to open again where they stay when engine is idling.

Oil pump is at half open position when engine is turned off at the ignition key, when ignition key is turned on the oil pump goes from half open to close to half open again and again this stays at the half open position when engine is idling.

Apologies for the confusion, I am in Scotland and our local term for switching off the ignition key is simply turn off ignition.


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 Post subject: Re: PV Control Box HELP
PostPosted: Mon May 21, 2018 8:44 am 
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Joined: Tue Jul 19, 2011 7:49 pm
Posts: 244
Location: Toulouse France
Ok.
Your PV controller doesn't detect the engine running. So valves always stay in open position ( and so do the oil pump ... ).
You have a Black/White wire that goes from the CDI unit to the PV controller and tachometer that you should check for continuity.
Does your tach run ?


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 Post subject: Re: PV Control Box HELP
PostPosted: Tue May 22, 2018 4:37 am 
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This is where the confusion arises for me, when viewing any online videos they all tell the same story, the valves are in the closed position when the ignition key is in the off position (see attached link), it also shows the oil pump being set up which is also in the closed position when ignition key is turned off.
When you turn the ignition key to on it shows the valves starting in the closed position then open, closed, open. my valves start in the open position then close, open. are the videos wrong?
https://youtu.be/yg96jsGoy2M


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 Post subject: Re: PV Control Box HELP
PostPosted: Tue May 22, 2018 4:45 am 
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Joined: Tue Jul 19, 2011 7:49 pm
Posts: 244
Location: Toulouse France
Videos are good.
Valves start in the closed position because when engine runs at idle speed, controller closes the valves, so when ignition key is turned off they stay in the closed position.
In your case, controller doesn't detect the CDI signal and doesn't close the valves.
That's why you should check the Black/White wire.
And does your tach run ??


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 Post subject: Re: PV Control Box HELP
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2018 4:51 am 
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Tach runs fine, I will check the black/white wire for continuity.

Thanks again for your help.


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