No Spark?

General forum on troubleshooting electrical problems and modifications to electrical systems

Moderator: rztom

Message
Author
User avatar
Yellow and Black RZ
Posts: 379
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2007 3:59 pm

Re: No Spark?

#16 Post by Yellow and Black RZ » Wed Feb 24, 2016 11:09 am

Side stand switch?
'85 RRZ350 - Hacked.

evan_calgary
Posts: 1368
Joined: Tue Nov 12, 2013 2:34 am

Re: No Spark?

#17 Post by evan_calgary » Wed Feb 24, 2016 10:28 pm

MK, already been done...have an electrical engineer on the job and still no luck. sidestand switch has been jumpered to eliminate. Back to a stock harness. Next step is confirming CDIs work then onward.

MK
Posts: 814
Joined: Sat Nov 26, 2005 11:44 am
Location: Wolfenbüttel, Germany
Contact:

Re: No Spark?

#18 Post by MK » Thu Feb 25, 2016 9:13 am

You said you tested more than one CDI.
Usually the CDI's work, so the likelyhood of grabbing 2 or 3 in one batch that don't work is close to zero.
If he followed what I wrote above there had to be an issue found.

The only escape lane for you is that you used one ore more of the rotor/stator/CDI combinations that don't work anyway.

To make the long story short: Whenever people have problems with the bloody CDI, I advise to get a programmable DC-CDI. It solves several issues at once AND adds a considerable amount of extra HP.
Bye
Martin

justind97
Posts: 202
Joined: Mon Aug 10, 2015 8:57 pm
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Re: No Spark?

#19 Post by justind97 » Thu Feb 25, 2016 12:19 pm

What about the neutral switch wire? Is that connected on the shift drum cover?

evan_calgary
Posts: 1368
Joined: Tue Nov 12, 2013 2:34 am

Re: No Spark?

#20 Post by evan_calgary » Thu Feb 25, 2016 1:39 pm

The neutral switch is just another ground but yes I have it connected.

MK, what you wrote was followed and it has all checked out. I forwarded this post to the guy after he looked at things and he said everything you indicated was done.

justind97
Posts: 202
Joined: Mon Aug 10, 2015 8:57 pm
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Re: No Spark?

#21 Post by justind97 » Thu Feb 25, 2016 2:58 pm

Based on what you have said, here's the only thing that I can find.
In the wiring diagram below, the main switch in the ON position has the Red/Brown connected, but ALSO the Blue with white stripe and blue with red stripe are connected. Not sure if you connected the last two together, I don't think I read that you did.


Image

evan_calgary
Posts: 1368
Joined: Tue Nov 12, 2013 2:34 am

Re: No Spark?

#22 Post by evan_calgary » Thu Feb 25, 2016 3:38 pm

Thanks for checking there Justin. Those 2 relate back to lights and not the engine operation off top of my head.

Need to check these boxes. Think I may order the zeel regardless. I didn't realize they are reasonably priced. Always thought an ignition was something like 6-800 bucks.

justind97
Posts: 202
Joined: Mon Aug 10, 2015 8:57 pm
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Re: No Spark?

#23 Post by justind97 » Thu Feb 25, 2016 4:06 pm

alright then.

Of all the things you have changed, what has remained constant?

I think you changed the harness, CDI, regulator, but what about the stator? I know it sends the proper voltage through.. but you never know.

evan_calgary
Posts: 1368
Joined: Tue Nov 12, 2013 2:34 am

Re: No Spark?

#24 Post by evan_calgary » Thu Feb 25, 2016 4:22 pm

That is part of the problem...bought the bike with that good old, 'just needs a battery' deal. Had a race harness that was a mess so stripped that out. From there I have used the pile of parts I have on hand to try and replace things one at a time. I do not have another running bike to swap out one piece at a time to confirm they all work.

This is really a large part of the problem...I will check back after I confirm the boxes work. If that doesn't fix it I will find another harness. Luckily there are a few guys in town with bikes I can possibly bother to help me out with checking parts...

RuZty
-----
-----
Posts: 3584
Joined: Fri Oct 03, 2003 11:11 pm
Location: Southern Ontario, Canada

Re: No Spark?

#25 Post by RuZty » Thu Feb 25, 2016 11:04 pm

You describe the problem as no spark and say that there is no power to the coil. Could you describe how you are testing this. i.e. are you failing to get a spark while kicking, and if so how are you confirming this, and under what conditions are you seeing no voltage to the coil.

evan_calgary
Posts: 1368
Joined: Tue Nov 12, 2013 2:34 am

Re: No Spark?

#26 Post by evan_calgary » Thu Feb 25, 2016 11:47 pm

Sorry, there is power at the coil tested with a multimeter. The bike is being tested for spark while kicking with the ignition turned on like you would to start. Plug in coil, grounded and kicking like would usually test for spark. Multiple plugs used of course to confirm not bad.

RuZty
-----
-----
Posts: 3584
Joined: Fri Oct 03, 2003 11:11 pm
Location: Southern Ontario, Canada

Re: No Spark?

#27 Post by RuZty » Fri Feb 26, 2016 1:09 am

Both plugs have to be in the circuit for a spark, coil is not grounded, spark is through the plug to ground and back to the coil through the other plug, hence the term wasted spark. If your test setup doesn't close this circuit you will have no spark. I did not understand it this way until it was explained on here a few years ago.

justind97
Posts: 202
Joined: Mon Aug 10, 2015 8:57 pm
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Re: No Spark?

#28 Post by justind97 » Fri Feb 26, 2016 10:04 am

What plugs and what plug boots are you running? Are they both designated with an 'R' ? If so, that can be another one of your issues.

I would personally change out the coil with the aftermarket wires for a stock known running one.

And for sure the compatibility of CDI to stator has been checked?

MK
Posts: 814
Joined: Sat Nov 26, 2005 11:44 am
Location: Wolfenbüttel, Germany
Contact:

Re: No Spark?

#29 Post by MK » Fri Feb 26, 2016 3:39 pm

Here's the compatibility table (excerpt from my tuning manual)
CDI_compatibility_table.png
CDI_compatibility_table.png (45.9 KiB) Viewed 1904 times
Please note that "works" was meant as "starts" - it turned out that some combinations would start, but have running issues.
Meanwhile I recommend the DC-CDI way and kept the table for historic reasons.

A couple of you already had similar issues:
http://www.rzrd500.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?t=8446" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.rzrd500.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?t=6345" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

This CDI would work for you:
https://www.ebay-kleinanzeigen.de/s-anz ... 2-306-7707" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Though programming is substantially more complicated than with the "normal" P2 CDI.
But the price is ok.

As I worked with the seller who was using it on a RD500, I could create a RZ350 suitable .ign-File to work with.
Bye
Martin

evan_calgary
Posts: 1368
Joined: Tue Nov 12, 2013 2:34 am

Re: No Spark?

#30 Post by evan_calgary » Fri Feb 26, 2016 6:17 pm

Thank you for the chart MK, that has SOLVED the issue. The bike came with an adjustable banshee timing plate on it so who knows which stator. After reversing the 2 wires on the stator the bike now has spark. Looks like the boxes and the stator on there were not compatible in that wiring setup.

MK, you have been extremely helpful through all this and I want to say a huge thank you for taking the time to help out with the diagnostics and hand-holding. Honestly very much appreciated.

Post Reply